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Soul music was a good article, but it has been removed from the list. There are suggestions below for improving the article to meet the good article criteria. Once these are addressed, the article can be renominated. Editors may also seek a reassessment of the decision if they believe there was a mistake. Delisted version: October 23, 2005 |
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It is requested that a photograph or photographs be included in this article to improve its quality. The Free Image Search Tool may be able to locate suitable images on Flickr and other web sites. |
Soul music is fundamentally rhythm and blues... If this is true then this article should simply redirect to that one. I don't think this is exactly accurate; soul seems to me a subset, evolution, or maturation of R&B. Even while soul was thriving, "R&B" encompassed funk, blues, disco, and even rap and proto-rap (e.g. Gil Scott-Heron) none of which are really soul music. I will take a shot at revamping the lead soon but this seems tricky enough to bear discussion here first. Any comments? Jgm 00:13, 28 Feb 2005 (UTC)
Nothing on Northern soul?
There are no images. slambo 17:52, 23 October 2005 (UTC)
The page chronicles the history of the genre but sorta neglects specific musical characteristics (e.g. specific keys, scales or transpositions). Is there anyone with something to say about this? JFW | T@lk 17:45, 10 January 2006 (UTC)
Why does the article dance around this fact without ever stating it? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 24.42.160.56 (talk • contribs) 25 May 2006.
Because, Ezeu: (i) Not everyone in this big wide world knows of the origins of soul music (ii) Wikipedia is an encyclopedia that ought to provide info as accurately as possible; Give the devil his due..."Know what I mean?" User: CodeLyric 29, November 2006
Well, well, Spylab, guess what? Technically speaking you got a point there "but not every one who plays/sings soul music is black". I'm happy for you! As a matter of fact, you got a keen eye, son. But man, your 'defense' of non-blacks in the soul community...stinks. It's hypocritical: The fact that you correct the usage of the preposition "by" in that statement while completely ignoring the injustice done to the African American people by not being mentioned as the originators of Soul Music reflects a well known phenomena of "white america"...(the 'king', rock and roll, n***** noise), ring any bells?? And that's what my brutha up there was really talking about mister.
Let me lay it out: No decent article can speak about European Classical Music without citing references to dudes such as Mozart or without placing dates, locations etc. Yes, any _serious_ article would dedicate a substantial portion to such matters. The fact that this article 'danced around' this particular 'right' is what that the heading there is really talking about...(which is so rather obvious - even for this African -, I don't know why I've got to be explaining this) but hey, somethings (and people) just don't change, right? Whatever.
You talk of "documentated facts backed up by reliable sources"?? Son, and just WHO provides these "documentated facts"?? WHO certifies these "reliable sources" my dear??? A Wikipedia administrator? Man, this is a cultural thing and if there is any one with the AUTHORITY to decide WHAT is SOUL..it is those WHO ORIGINATED and DEVELOPED it. User: codelyric, 10 July 2007
According to the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, soul is "music that arose out of the black experience in America through the transmutation of gospel and rhythm & blues into a form of funky, secular testifying."[1]
Following that, in the Origins section, the article names people who are known as the originators of soul music, and most (if not all) of them are black or some kind of mixture of black. I'm not sure how that is "dancing around the issue" of the black American origins of soul music. I'm also not sure where I have supposedly "defended" non-blacks in the soul community other than to say they have existed, which is a documented fact. Also, where's the so-called hypocricy you accuse me of? Bottom line: Wikipedia policy is to present facts backed up by reliable references, regardless of the race, nationalality, religion, class, hair colour etc. of the writer. Wikipedia articles are not places to express personal opinions or to post original research. If you have any specific suggestions to improve the article, feel free to list list them here or make the changes to the article yourself.Spylab 11:23, 11 July 2007 (UTC)
Dear Spylab, I've intentionally "bounced back" hoping to see how someone would respond...its incredible, but anyway. Its sad, to say the least, that somehow you either don't see or just don't want to see things in context, for a soul...well atleast, you got a cool head. Anyway, again, I'll lay out things for you:
- In the first place, your reference to the "Rock and Roll Hall of Fame" block and "Origin" section DID NOT EXIST when that brutha spawned this thread. Otherwise, both he and Ezeu back there would have been stark raving mad to have been discussing the issue in the first place! CAN'T YOU SEE THAT!? So, please do not quote things that have been edited AFTER and therefore not in context. Neither was I speaking of the present document. Re-READ my previous edit! I am defending a soul brutha who had every right to have raised that particular complaint, even though he might have not used 'text book' english...of which you corrected him.
- You are not sure how you "defended" non-blacks in the soul community? Are you sure, that you are not sure?? Check it: You begun you other statement like "...but not every one who plays/sings soul music is black, and not all black musicians and singers perform soul music...", I mean wtf? Of course not! But have you ever heard of the term African American Music? Black Music? Huh? How may non-blacks up that mutha right now? Plenty! But, has the title African American Music ever been an issue?? And that's why when I hit Ezeu back there I said "Give the Devil his due". Sylab, we could begin going into a hundred million factors and play games all day but this is not a mathematical problem man. Its a cultural issue.
- Where is the hypocrisy? Well then, I'll quote it again, "The fact that you (are sharp enough) correct the usage of the preposition "by" in that statement while completely ignoring the injustice done to the African American people by not being mentioned as the originators of Soul Music reflects a well known phenomena...", is that clear? ( And don't start quoting things from the present somewhat 'rectified' articles ) I was speaking in the context of 'then'
- I quote you, "Wikipedia policy is to present facts backed up by reliable references, regardless of the race, nationalality, religion, class, hair colour etc. of the writer." And I ask you, "Sylab, who is denying (or has denied) this? Please, don't even quote it...As a matter of fact, I was the one demanding justice! what the..."
And oh, yes, I frequently freely contribute to changes in many a "such" an article...codelyric 11 July 2007
Th'Gator here. I'm completely new to Wikipedia input, and this method of expressing my opinions seems somehow wrong - I should be adding a post instead of editing existing ones. If someone would set me straight on how to do this properly, I'd deeply appreciate it.
Perhaps it would help if I pointed out that "gospel music" originated from a religion, primarily white Western European in influence, which was taught (perhaps forcibly) to enslaved Africans, many of whom had to abandon their animistic religions learned from birth.
While they made Christian religion uniquely their own, the roots of that religion were shared by those who taught them. Therefore, it's realistic to hypothesize that soul music would easily migrate to those descendants of slaveowners who shared the same religious practices. For this reason, I'd suggest that soul music be described as being INSPIRED by black origins.
Though I grew up in the New Orleans area, I'm new to really understanding what's soul, what's R&B, etc. The movie "Ray" helped a lot, but I'm not from the same traditions as most of the slaves' teachers. I'm just plain not good at classifying music anyway.
I'd like to nominate Janis Joplin of "Big Brother and the Holding Company" and many country (& Western) artists, especially "Alabama", as white soul artists. Should anyone object to the latter, I suggest that someone else (I'm really busy, but I had to comment here) check out the TV special on "Alabama" which removed the instruments from a rendition of one of their songs. The "a cappella" result was pure gospel. Th'Gator (talk) 10:39, 7 July 2008 (UTC)
I removed a link to Juliette leon in myspace. Let me know if that was a mistake. We generally don't link to myspace. :) Dlohcierekim 12:09, 30 May 2006 (UTC) Re-added by anon. :) Dlohcierekim 12:16, 30 May 2006 (UTC)
This article is written from a rather highly biased point of view. Soul music is more than just the recordings most loved by rockists (Aretha Franklin, Otis Redding, et al.), although they are certainly among the greats. The article needs to be re-written to encompass a greater focus (The Chi-Lites aren't soul?!). --FuriousFreddy 00:09, 2 July 2006 (UTC)
Half of the links in this article look like spam to me:
Are these meant to reference something? If not they should be deleted. Thoughts? Strobilus 22:15, 4 April 2007 (UTC)
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BetacommandBot 02:31, 6 September 2007 (UTC)
I'm flagging this.... There is a simmering black/white issue here from the arguments I'm reading... I'm hoping that a music PhD will come and clean up this article.... It probably needs better verification... I'm having problems with Louis Prima. All I know about Louis Prima is Keely Smith and some jazz standards from the 40s and 50s... Back then it was called R&B - by about the late 50's, early 60's....a particular form of R&B became known as soul music... However - An expert will help greatly...
02:31, 19 December 2007 (UTC)
Image:What'dISay.ogg is being used on this article. I notice the image page specifies that the image is being used under fair use but there is no explanation or rationale as to why its use in this Wikipedia article constitutes fair use. In addition to the boilerplate fair use template, you must also write out on the image description page a specific explanation or rationale for why using this image in each article is consistent with fair use.
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BetacommandBot (talk) 12:48, 21 January 2008 (UTC)
Took him out completely from this article. He did what was loosely termed R&B at the time. The best examples of his music are the remakes done by rockers in previous years such as "I Ain't Got Nobody" by David Lee Roth & "Jump, Jive N Wail" by the Brian Setzer Orchestra - which isn't of course, soul music, but a highly energized form of swing music and/or jump blues. The entire American swing revival of the late 90s took its cue from Louis Prima rather than Glenn Miller. Soul music descended from the "black churches" and influenced the rhythm and blues scene - not created out of spontaneity.
13:16, 20 May 2008 (UTC)
The article says the following: "Cultural origins: late 1950s United States (esp. New York, Chicago, Illinois)". Why?? I thought soul music was created in US state of Georgia by Ray Charles and James Brown. Netrat_msk (talk) 15:58, 29 May 2008 (UTC)
How about moving Neo soul from fusion forms to subgenres? Neo soul is surely influenced by hip-hop, but it almost never features any rapping or scratching etc. so actually it is rather influenced by hip-hop soul than hip hop itself. IMHO neo soul is a part of moder soul music rather than hip hop. So unless we believe soul music died out in late 1970 to be completely replaced by contemporary R&B, neo soul should be regarded as its sub-genre. Netrat_msk (talk) 12:14, 30 May 2008 (UTC)
I see no link and google has no answers. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 65.31.143.193 (talk) 04:22, 1 September 2008 (UTC)
"Rhythm and blues (also known as R&B, R'n'B or RnB) is a popular music genre combining jazz, gospel, and blues influences." —Preceding unsigned comment added by 89.139.159.77 (talk) 18:56, 19 September 2008 (UTC)
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